RE: Sports, religion strange bedfellows
This post is a letter I sent Rick Telander, a Chicago Sun-Times columnist in regard to his article Sports, religion strange bedfellows. Please read the article here.
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Dear Rick,
I was frustrated after reading your article and have been sorely tempted to fling an ad-hominem laden vindictive your way. Of course you might assume that my desire to do such springs from my supposed inherent intolerance that is (naturally) inextricably bound to my religious beliefs. But then again, you probably know that such assumptions are dangerous because they are often wrong, and are a form of intolerance that unfairly binds others to a preconceived idea.
No, I’m not frustrated by the fact that people such as you feel threatened by religion–that happens all the time. Really, the frustrating thing is that I expect someone like you to be a true man of letters and to actually know what the words you use so freely mean. You, as an educated individual, ought to be aware that the way in which words are used gives rise to a whole series of implications, which are subject to the same critique as the content itself. Really your article doesn’t make logical sense.
You are troubled because you feel that Dungy thinks proper coaching is a matter of dogma. But why should you be troubled by such an innocuous common-place thing? Dogma means holding a set of beliefs to be true. Everyone has dogmas–you are dogmatic about the fact that religion and sports should not be mixed. Everyone has beliefs that they feel are true and these beliefs work their way into every aspect of life. This is perfectly normal, so really what seems to trouble you is what Dungy does actually believe. To me that sounds pretty darn intolerant–Dungy has some beliefs that you don’t necessarily agree with and you refuse to tolerate him talking about them; however if he talks about other beliefs, such as how to manage a defense, you are not bothered (even if you feel the defense ought to be managed differently).
Later in your article you raise what you feel is an important question: “Where does the sports teaching end and the proselytizing begin?” That is an important question to some degree, but the answer, in Dungy’s case, is likely not damning at all, though it appears that you feel it is. The fact is that people are proselytizing all the time about all kinds of different things. It is a fact of human nature: if you like or dislike something you are going to tell people about it and you hope that they agree with you (so that they can experience the same joy you do or avoid the pain you went through). Once again, the apparent problem with Dungy is what he may be proselytizing, not the proselytizing itself. If proselytizing itself were wrong your article would be self-referentially incoherent.
Obviously Faith is a touchy subject because it reaches to the core of who an individual is and people feel threatened when their core identity is questioned–but I don’t think trying to repress the questions is a good reaction. You don’t like the idea of belief in God? Don’t argue that no one should ever talk about belief in God in your presence, instead search your intellect and emotions on why you don’t believe; be honest with yourself. If you’re still confident about what you believe or refuse to believe then the other questions that challenged you won’t pose any difficulty.
Men and women of integrity think deeply about what they believe and they speak it honestly, even if others disagree. That is commendable, and Tony Dungy is a man of Integrity. You have every right to challenge Dungy’s way of speaking about his beliefs, but know that you and he are exercising the same right and that your condemnation of his behavior is applicable to your words as well. Arguments made in the form you used are not valid.
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Sincerely,
T Poindexter
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UPDATE:Â Here’s a letter sent in by a friend of mine:
Mr. Telander,
In the name of “tolerance,” I respect your opinion on Tony Dungy’s post-Super Bowl comments on his Christian faith. However, I fundamentally disagree with your viewpoint. Nonetheless, I would ask you to sincerely think about one thing…tolerance of all worldviews, except the profession of a Christian worldview, isn’t really tolerance at all. At it’s core, it is intolerant to the Christian worldview. As such, your bemoaning of Tony Dungy’s public profession of faith is, at its most basic level, intolerance towards Chrisitanity.
Tony Dungy’s declaration is no more intolerant to individuals of other religions than a declartion thanking his mother and father would have been to orphans or children of single parent households.
My main point can be summarized in this manner: Arguments that are self-defeating (e.g. preaching “tolerance” by being intolerant to opinions that are different than your own) are not really arguments for tolerance, but rather the expression of your own worldview. It’s okay to have a different worldview/opinion, but you shouldn’t hide behind “tolerance.” After all, using your words, I have often wondered if sports columnists should stick to the X’s and O’s of the sports world and not preach hidden agendas or personal ideologies.
Thank you for taking the time to read this.
Clay Weidner
Columbus, Ohio (via Monticello, IL)
That was really cool! I hope he takes the time to think about it, because i think it was very well written. Also, that was the most polite way to disagree/argue i have ever seen in my entire life, I LOVE tony dungy, and i LOVE that hes a christian, so way to go!!
Good letter, Tim.
actually i didn’t find their comments dangerous or threatening, merely ridiculous and besides-the-point, cheapening the effort of the players/coaches:
I Hope God (if there is one or many) Has Better Things Than to Ensure Football Victories
and i think you are willfully ignoring the key to his comments, what if an american football coach proclaimed that Vishnu, Allah, etc… gave them the victory… watching Dungy post-game was depressing… and now hearing about his connections to the fascist branch of Christianity, it is just sad that such a caring man would allow his glorious moment be co-opted to promote hate and discrimination.
[quote comment="898"]…and i think you are willfully ignoring the key to his comments, what if an american football coach proclaimed that Vishnu, Allah, etc… gave them the victory… watching Dungy post-game was depressing… and now hearing about his connections to the fascist branch of Christianity, it is just sad that such a caring man would allow his glorious moment be co-opted to promote hate and discrimination.[/quote]
Thanks for the comment, thivai! I did willfully ignore the part you mention, but not because it is the “key” to his comments, rather because I don’t think it matters at all. It wouldn’t bother me in the least if someone got up and thanked Vishnu or Allah or the Flying Spaghetti Monster for support after winning a major sports championship. I would probably think it a bit strange, but seriously doubt I would be offended.
And really, I don’t think Dungy’s comments should be construed as saying that God gave him the victory; he said that he thought it is worth noting that you can be a Christian and still win a major sporting event. You ought to remember that Lovie Smith is a Christian too (and one of Dungy’s best friends). If you think Dungy was saying that God prefers him and handed him the victory because he favors him I think it is safe to say that you have badly misconstrued his comments.
Your allegations of Dungy’s ties to “fascist branches of Christianity” are coming out of left field. I’m not aware of any such ties, perhaps you can provide some links to back up your claim.
From Tealander’s article:
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“Dungy is set to be the honored speaker at the Indiana Family Institute’s ”Friends of the Family” banquet March 20 in Carmel, Ind. There are large Internet posters of him in his Colts coaching garb advertising the event. Tickets cost $75 and will help fund IFI, which is a nonprofit conservative Christian group that recently filed a brief to the 7th Court of Appeals asking that prayer be allowed to start each day on the floor of the Indiana legislature.
IFI is affiliated with Focus on Family, a conservative Christian organization that is gay-repressive and is holding a conference about homosexuality this weekend in Phoenix that will be protested by gay- advocacy groups.
”We will be presenting the truth about homosexuality,” Focus on Family spokeswoman Melissa Fryrear said in a statement, adding that her group will show gays ”it is possible to walk away from homosexuality.”
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You are not to familiar with Focus on the Family the fascist, homophobic, conservative Christian movement?
People for the American Way: Focus on the Family
Brian McKinley on Focus on the Family
Focus on the Family’s Lobbying Arm
Anti-Racist Action Network on Focus on the Family
Chris Hedges: The Christian Right and the Rise of American Fascism
Chris Hedges: Soldiers of Christ
they are pimping dungy in his colors for their event–posters, come see the conquering christian hero (exagerration, of course, but completely missing the mark–no)
you may not have been disturbed if the winning coach had spouted the same sentiments about another deity, but i’m sure it would have caused a storm across america nonetheless–its easy to ignore when it is the dominant belief-system, but the implications are much more clearer when it is enacted by a minority… you seriously believe that if Dungy had substituted Allah for the Christian God, that a whole nation of Christians would not have freaked, stating that this is not the place for this… now where can we find a Hindu or Muslim football coach…
For a man who seems so set on stopping the spread of hate your comments have quite a livid tone to them. Perhaps you deeply resent Christianity itself, which is fine with me. However, I don’t want the whole purpose of my letter to get lost in our discussion, because I think your frustrations are not directed at the letter (though you may feel that they are)–rather your frustrations seem to be towards Christianity itself and individuals who embrace that faith and who use their influence to ascert or maintain Christianity as a “dominant” religion.
But, as I mentioned in my letter, it is a trait of human nature to try and gain influence for whatever is important to you. You, through your comments, are participating in a form of lobbying yourself–and you have every right to do this; the thing that bothers me is when individuals, such as Telander and perhaps such as yourself, try and use arguments that apply to the entire field but claim (or feel) that these arguments do not, in fact, apply to the entire field, but rather to only one small part of it (i.e. the “fascist christians”). I’m tired of people who embrace free speech but then readily condemn others for using it in a way which they deem “intolerant.”
I have heard of Focus on the Family, and they are hardly “fascist.” Call them up and ask if they support centralized control of the government by a dictator, they’ll probably burst out laughing. However, they certainly are conservative, and they embrace a form of conservatism that I reject–I don’t think schools or government assemblies should open with prayer, and from a religious perspective I wouldn’t be upset at all if “In God We Trust” was removed from our coinage (though historical objections to such a removal may have more weight).
The important thing is this: to some degree it is the same laws that keep pornography legal, and allow Scientology in the US (though I believe it is outlawed in parts of Europe) also allow Tony Dungy to say that he’s a Christian on national television. Arguing against one of those things will inevitably pit you against all of them.
Listen: I don’t care if you don’t like Christianity–but just say that; don’t come out with this sidestepping BS about how Tony Dungy was
foaming at the mouthon national television with intolerance and hate, not only have your arguments overstepped the facts, but your logic on why he should have never said what he did invalidates your own argument.I have no problem with Christianity as a concept, I do have a problem though with the radical right Christian movement attempting to wrest control of my country and turn it into a theocratic state.
I never said Tony was foaming at the mouth (your words), I did say he was being pimped by fascist segments of the Christian right. In this he is no different than many honest, admirable Christians who are manipulated by these foundations:
Chris Hedges on “American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War On America
I would appreciate you addressing my points and quit trying to put words in my mouth… of course, I really don’t care whether you believe me on this (truly, it doesn’ matter, but I do believe in dialogue), its just my opinion and yours is yours.
I regularly read and promote progressive Christian writings, like those in Sojourners and The Christian Century … but go ahead dismiss me as a hater of Christianity, I understand that this eis asier than paying attention to the dangerous aspects of our dominant religion.
Peace
[quote comment="902"]I have no problem with Christianity as a concept, I do have a problem though with the radical right Christian movement attempting to wrest control of my country and turn it into a theocratic state.[/quote]
That makes your position much clearer; I avoided using absolute terms in referencing what I thought your position may be because I couldn’t quite tell; this statement helps greatly and I don’t think I have any problem aligning myself with you on the statement. I stand against any theocratic state, Christian or otherwise.
[quote comment="902"]I never said Tony was foaming at the mouth (your words), I did say he was being pimped by fascist segments of the Christian right. In this he is no different than many honest, admirable Christians who are manipulated by these foundations: …[/quote]
I don’t think I agree that the segments he is being “pimped by” are fascist, however it is true that many Christians are manipulated by “Christian” organizations. I actually started an organization myself that opposes such practices: The Christian Anti-Christian Coalition Coalition.
[quote comment="902"]I would appreciate you addressing my points and quit trying to put words in my mouth… [/quote]
Addressing as requested…
[quote comment="902"]I regularly read and promote progressive Christian writings, like those in Sojourners and The Christian Century … but go ahead dismiss me as a hater of Christianity, I understand that this eis asier than paying attention to the dangerous aspects of our dominant religion.[/quote]
Speaking of putting words in someone’s mouth, I never said you were a “hater of Christianity,” nor have I dismissed you. Furthermore your implication that I ignore “the dangerous aspects” of Christianity is probably false (I think it’s clearly false, but you may disagree since I don’t grant that Focus on the Family can be accurately described by the term “Fascist.”).
I think I’ve address all you points, alert me if I’ve missed any. I’m not sure, however, that any of the statements I’ve made are invalidated or even addressed by your statements. My argument in the letter stands pristine. Was your main point to lament the fact that you feel that Tony Dungy is being “pimped” by questionable organizations?
yep–that was my point
and you invited to me admit that i hated christianity–same as saying that i did (just a politie evasion of saying it)
of course we are on the same page–just dancing around clarifying our positions
i still see focus on the family as a problem though
peace